Reichu's Revelations: Rei, Kaworu, and Everything in Between

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Postby Mr. Tines [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:58 pm

Reichu wrote:What do you mean, exactly? Image



The idea that the "little" legs are, in effect, unharvested Rei-clones that have either been left beyond their optimal ripeness for picking, or never quite formed properly and have just gone on getting bigger.

//all the other stuff...

This is all coming together very nicely now.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 18:38 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:58 pm

Mr. Tines wrote:The idea that the "little" legs are, in effect, unharvested Rei-clones that have either been left beyond their optimal ripeness for picking, or never quite formed properly and have just gone on getting bigger.



Image

//all the other stuff...

This is all coming together very nicely now.



Wait until I manage to put it all together. Screw this "How to Make an Impact" stuff. What I am fated to assemble, for "Evangelion" geeks everywhere", can be nothing BUT "From Beginning to End", and it will cover ALL of the mysterious background details that have come to light, from the First Ancestor Race to Yui's Fate. It will be absolutely breathtaking. (And I'm not saying that to sound arrogant. I'm as surprised by all of this as any of you.)

And...

Image

Image

Image

Image


Sweet Yui Ha Mashiyach!
I just realized something that makes absolute sense of what has, until now, been a complete and utter enigma to me. It sounds incredibly messed-up at first, but, believe me, once I lay everything out, it won't. Trust me.

Kaworu is not a male.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 18:53 GMT

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Postby Mr. Tines [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:58 pm

Reichu wrote:Kaworu is not a male.



We've already discussed that he doesn't have an obvious core on the basis of Shinji's (lack of) reaction; so I presume you're not talking about the meatbody ve is using.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:12 GMT

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Postby Magami No ER [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:58 pm

I'll hope your presumsuption is correct. Image

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:29 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:58 pm

Mr. Tines wrote:We've already discussed that he doesn't have an obvious core on the basis of Shinji's (lack of) reaction; so I presume you're not talking about the meatbody ve is using.



I'm not sure what you mean. What does a visible core have to do with the basis for a sex?

Regarding the meatbody part: Actually, I am very serious. Here is one of the tipoffs:

Image

Although it ties into a lot of other things that I can't get into right now. This one is just so incredibly messed-up that you might as well prepare yourselves in advance. Kaworu, it turns out, is perhaps the most incredibly misunderstood character in this show, to the point where it is sickening. Albeit not very surprising, at all. Kaworu has had everyone but Shinji fooled. That Anno, he's a trixty one, all right... He's been cackling this entire time, I'm sure.

But this actually doesn't falsify what Kaworu tells Rei, at all. There are real XX-chromos out there who have the secondary sexual characteristics of a male, and this is what is going on with Kaworu. (If you're very clever, you'll be able to figure out why without me telling you.)

Don't make up your mind about this one before I explain it completely. Like I said, it's so mind-blowing that you deserve some time to let it sink in before the Promised Time.

@Mr. Tines: Now that I've processed your statement about Kaworu and Nigouki a little more, exactly what did you mean when you compared the possibility of fusion to Rei and Lilith? That EVA-02 would become a giant Kaworu, or something?

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:30 GMT

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Postby Magami No ER [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:59 pm

>.<
Unless we're talking something similar to the sexless andromity of Nataku (Clamp's "X"), I'm not very sure he should be looked into that way.
(Yes, I know of genetic abnormalites in alleles, unfully formed chromosomes, and in-distinguishable gender. Souls are another matter completely) Does this make Kaworu fully female in Lilium body terms? I doubt it highly. Obviously his body has more testastrone then Shinji(at this current time)based on his deeper voice.
Maybe you should explain your thoughts again so I don't misunderstand anything you're saying.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:43 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:59 pm

I'm basically saying that Kaworu is a young woman with the secondary sexual characteristics of a male. Meaning, deep voice, broad shoulders, no fatty padding, blah blah blah. XX chromosome. Female. The superficial appearance comes from you-know-who. The other part... well, maybe you can figure it out.

Like I said, don't reject it outright. Just consider it for now. I don't think the show can make complete sense if this is not the case... Shinji's strange glance sure makes perfect sense if there is something very, VERY strange about Kaworu-kun. But that was just the initial "click". Like I said... the rest will come later...

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:47 GMT

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Postby Mr. Tines [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:59 pm

Reichu wrote:I'm not sure what you mean. What does a visible core have to do with the basis for a sex?



Not sex, but the appearance of unexpected anatomy in general.

Assuming that the tip-off is not a selection effect (like Asuka caught in mid-blink to look like she's sizing Shinji up), then that could equally well be an instance of seeing how one sizes up in general.

But if true, it will cause shrieks and howls from the yaoi-fangirls, and put a whole new spin on the GNK sequence.

Reichu wrote:exactly what did you mean when you compared the possibility of fusion to Rei and Lilith? That EVA-02 would become a giant Kaworu, or something?



At the very least - if not capable of then compelling 3I then and there, at least of spawning other new Angels.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:47 GMT

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Postby Dr. Nick [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:59 pm

Reichu wrote:Shinji's strange glance sure makes perfect sense if there is something very, VERY strange about Kaworu-kun.


He should be more freaked out if there was something strange going on downstairs.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:56 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:59 pm

Mr. Tines wrote:Not sex, but the appearance of unexpected anatomy in general.



Kaworu has a Super Solenoid, so... ve presumably has a core to contain it. Somewhere in there.

Assuming that the tip-off is not a selection effect (like Asuka caught in mid-blink to look like she's sizing Shinji up)



Going through the show frame-by-frame is so much fun! Image (And, actually, absolutely crucial for figuring it out completely, when all is said and done.)

then that could equally well be an instance of seeing how one sizes up in general.



Then Kaworu-kun ends up being PRET-TY damn small. Well... I guess that depends... Image

But if true, it will cause shrieks and howls from the yaoi-fangirls, and put a whole new spin on the GNK sequence.



...which I have sort of suggested in the past anyway. Funny how this stuff pans out. A lot of ideas that are mentioned idly, facetiously, and just in the "I dunno" sort of way have actually ended up being more relevant than could have been anticipated.

And all of those yaoi fangirls deserve it. Image (No offense if you are one. You can still pretend. Heh heh.) The Shinji-Kaworu relationship gains such an incredible depth of meaning once you strip away that homosexual nonsense, it's ludicrous. Although Shinji's initial confusion kind of echoes a relationship with a certain someone else... doesn't it?

At the very least - if not capable of then compelling 3I then and there, at least of spawning other new Angels.



I need to go through some relevant parts of the show some more before I make a conclusive determination. But, yes... offspring would be involved...

Dr. Nick wrote:He should be more freaked out if there was something strange going on downstairs.



Isn't that basically what I implied? Image

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 19:59 GMT

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Postby Mr. Tines [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:59 pm

Reichu wrote:Isn't that basically what I implied? Image



He's not freaked out enough to have discovered that Kaworu-kun is a flat-chested girl. That expression is more one indicating that Kaworu is not significantly more endowed than Shinji....

OTOH, Shinji has been accused of needing to grow a pair - and seems to have a prediliction for that pair being of breasts.

What if all the Children were actually female...?

Originally posted on: 28-Jan-2006, 08:11 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:59 pm

Mr. Tines wrote:He's not freaked out enough to have discovered that Kaworu-kun is a flat-chested girl. That expression is more one indicating that Kaworu is not significantly more endowed than Shinji....



Oh, right, right. Shinji isn't what you would call "normal", though. You really have to consider NGE's method of storytelling, too... Subtleties that only the most astute and trustworthy geeks will pick up on. What kind of significance does "sizing Kaworu up" have to do with anything? Absolutely nothing. At this point in the series, things are running on 100% economy, and virtually everything has a point that will be way beyond the grasp of the average, rather dismissive audience who look only at the surface superficialities, and not beyond... And we don't want to be them, now do we, kids?

What did I say about rejecting this in advance? Eh?

OTOH, Shinji has been accused of needing to grow a pair - and seems to have a prediliction for that pair being of breasts.



Yeah... That one still doesn't make complete sense to me...

What if all the Children were actually female...?



Image Well, if true, that would be another instance of "random facetious comment = prophecy" Would that make the "Toji = lesbian" comment I made in "Go Hikari!"... eh, nevermind...

There is a reason for Kaworu being female. I can't think of any particular reasons for the other two. Image Shinji has toothpicks, thermal expansion, morning glories, chronic wankage (which seems suspiciously un-female-like in #25'), Misato's advances, a handful of semen, etc., etc., in his favor...

Originally posted on: 28-Jan-2006, 08:31 GMT

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Postby OMF [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:00 pm

Reichu wrote:Kaworu is not a male.

I feel so vindicated right now.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 21:16 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:00 pm

OMF wrote:I feel so vindicated right now.



...Why? Kaworu isn't an "it" either, lad. If you're still clinging to those ideas of yours, you're missing the point of why Kaworu is, despite a decade of yaoi, a girl, and the very reason I came to this realization in the first place. Once you see the complete picture, there will be absolutely nothing to feel "vindicated" about, because your ideas about the Adam/Lilith/Eva gender issue are invalid, and the story cannot make sense unless you accept that they are all completely female and will never be anything BUT.

Wait. And see. Thou shalt not let Fuzzy Logic consume thee. This is one of the 7 Deadly Sins of "Evangelion" geekdom.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 21:43 GMT

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Postby OMF [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:00 pm

Reichu wrote:If you're still clinging to those ideas of yours, you're missing the point of why Kaworu is, despite a decade of yaoi, a girl, and the very reason I came to this realization in the first place.



Reichu, I think I can say,with no ire intended, that my obstinacy on the absoluteness of the SoL's gender, may yet be helpful to you here.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 22:10 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:00 pm

While things make sense to me to the degree that I sincerely doubt it, send me a PM if you really think so. Reichu likes to be all ears if she can help it.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 22:17 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:00 pm

@OMF: Also, are you taking the principles of metaphysical biology into account here? Does your "obstinance" consider this in the slightest?

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 22:34 GMT

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Postby K2Grey [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:01 pm

The idea that Kaworu is a girl officially does not receive my Seal of Approval. Now I suppose that Adam is a mother figure and thus may be referred to as female, but I'm inclined to think that Kaworu is not a natural Angel and that SEELE does not care that much about the precise nature of the body they stick him in. For Kaworu to be female with male secondary characteristics would only make sense if Kaworu had a natural body, if his soul somehow altered his body, or if SEELE had too much time on their hands.

If Eva-02 actually won (for my part I feel that Eva-02 + Kaworu could take Yui) I suppose that if Kaworu has Adam's soul, and Eva-02 is a clone of Adam, then the combination would be effectively Adam, if we leave Gendo's hand out of the equation.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 23:13 GMT

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Postby OMF [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:01 pm

Believe me Reichu, I'm looking at all the angles. Admittedly though, my thinking is still within the box. Wherever that is.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 23:14 GMT

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Postby Reichu [ANF] » Fri Oct 19, 2007 10:01 pm

I just watched #24' again, and I noticed that they refer to Kaworu as a "he" (even Shinji, at the end). This isn't terribly surprising, though... since Shinji has no idea what the hell is going on, what the heck Kaworu is babbling about, and just WHAT we saw in that thar shower.

Or, if he did, saying "kanojo" around anybody else would have been... Well, geez, could you possibly blame him? Plus, it would be EXTREMELY non-Anno-like. Anno=Shinji, in a way, and, like Anno, Shinji is discovered the great, wide world of women and how messed up some of them can be. GYAH HAH HAH!

But in any case, Kaworu being female, like I said, ties into a number of other things, and actually made one more piece of the Second Impact puzzle click into place. Funny how that works.

Oh yeah. I figured out the monolith thing, too. Mostly. Image

OMF wrote:Believe me Reichu, I'm looking at all the angles. Admittedly though, my thinking is still within the box. Wherever that is.



Go ahead and PM me, e-mail me, whatever, just so we can get it over with and I can disembowel you if need be. Image

K2Grey wrote:The idea that Kaworu is a girl officially does not receive my Seal of Approval.



Tsk tsk tsk. Doubters, doubters, everywhere. It sucks to be me sometimes.

Now I suppose that Adam is a mother figure and thus may be referred to as female



There are a lot more reasons than that.

but I'm inclined to think that Kaworu is not a natural Angel and that SEELE does not care that much about the precise nature of the body they stick him in. For Kaworu to be female with male secondary characteristics would only make sense if Kaworu had a natural body, if his soul somehow altered his body, or if SEELE had too much time on their hands.



I've determined how Tabris was created and why. For the latter, there are multiple reasons. It ought to blow your mind.

If Eva-02 actually won (for my part I feel that Eva-02 + Kaworu could take Yui) I suppose that if Kaworu has Adam's soul, and Eva-02 is a clone of Adam, then the combination would be effectively Adam, if we leave Gendo's hand out of the equation.



More to it than that.

Originally posted on: 27-Jan-2006, 23:23 GMT


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