Mass Production Evangelions & Dummy Systems

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Mass Production Evangelions & Dummy Systems

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Postby Sachi » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:38 am

ok, you know how in the episode with Jet Alone, while Gendo was in the airplane with that other man and thye were talking about the rest of the Evangelion Series being made?
the man said that they were being made in different countries, so, then how do thye all have the same design and how did they get Tabris' Dummy system, because the were launched so soon after Tabris' death.
so what happened?

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Postby Anonymous_Evafan » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:48 am

What is mass production?
American Heritage Dictionary wrote:mass production
n. The manufacture of goods in large quantities, often using standardized designs and assembly-line techniques.

They've been in production for some time.
ep #22 wrote:Misato:
Construction of Evas up through Unit 13 has begun?
In seven different locations around the world?

HYUGA:
This information came via Shanghai. The source can be trusted.

Misato:
Why are they rushing mass production at this stage?

HYUGA:
We've lost two Evas in the past and two are currently heavily damaged.
Perhaps they're rushing to reinforce our reserves
with an eye towards the secondary preparations.

Misato:
I don't know.
Even here, we're getting Germany to give us parts
from Unit 05 and 06 that are being built there.
There seems to be a lot of money changing hands lately.

EVA-03 and EVA-04 had an identical design armor wise and presumibly physically. Kyoko seems to have gone nutty with EVA-02.
Last edited by Anonymous_Evafan on Tue Jan 23, 2007 9:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ornette » Tue Jan 23, 2007 10:25 am

Seele could have done all the work for the Kaworu dummy plugs before they sent him to Nerv. Nerv itself didn't have anything to do with those, Seele did.

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Postby Lleonard Pler » Tue Jan 23, 2007 11:41 am

Ornette wrote:Seele could have done all the work for the Kaworu dummy plugs before they sent him to Nerv. Nerv itself didn't have anything to do with those, Seele did.


That's what Sadamoto showed in the manga, actually.

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Postby TriLink » Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:02 pm

I'm gonna go a little off topic here (not too far though).

The Dummy Plug Systems, what exactly are they? Recordings of Rei and Kawrous thought patterns meant to only fool the Eva's or are they somehow more than that?

Forgive my ignorance, but nitpicking little things like this have never been my strongpoint.
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Postby Reichu » Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:38 pm

TriLink12 wrote:I'm gonna go a little off topic here (not too far though).

The Dummy Plug Systems, what exactly are they? Recordings of Rei and Kawrous thought patterns meant to only fool the Eva's or are they somehow more than that?

Do a search for "dummy", read what's already been argued through, and then get back to us with the answer, since nobody seems to know.
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Postby MaggotMaster » Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:42 pm

I seem to be the only human being alive who thinks the mass production evas are awesome, I mean fuck they look bizarre enough for me to like them.
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Postby Reichu » Thu Jan 25, 2007 8:51 pm

MaggotMaster wrote:I seem to be the only human being alive who thinks the mass production evas are awesome, I mean fuck they look bizarre enough for me to like them.

...ara? I've encountered plenty of har-- Mass Production Model Evangelion fans. I think they're all batshit insane out of their minds, but...
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Postby TriLink » Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:43 pm

After running my search as instructed, the popular theory seems to be that each dummy plug has a clone physically inside of it?

Plausible I suppose, at least in the Eva universe. And we know Gendo dosen't have any problem crossing those shady ethical lines so that wouldn't be an issue AND it explains that tank of Rei's Ritsuko destroyed.

She said they were "spare Rei's" but seeing as how they'd only lost 2 up to that point in the last 14 years, it hardly seems necessary to keep that many around unless they were using them for dummy systems as well. HmmF, I say they only lost two like that isn't a lot or something.

Perhaps this issue will be elaborated upon in Rebuild, ay?
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Postby Anonymous_Evafan » Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:52 pm

Reichu said there seemed to be something about that in Chronicle. We must wait till she gets around to translating it.
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Postby Mundane » Thu Jan 25, 2007 11:52 pm

Reichu wrote:
MaggotMaster wrote:I seem to be the only human being alive who thinks the mass production evas are awesome, I mean fuck they look bizarre enough for me to like them.

...ara? I've encountered plenty of har-- Mass Production Model Evangelion fans. I think they're all batshit insane out of their minds, but...


But now you have more proof.

AMIRITE?
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Postby Anonymous_Evafan » Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:19 am

Mundane wrote:
Reichu wrote:
MaggotMaster wrote:I seem to be the only human being alive who thinks the mass production evas are awesome, I mean fuck they look bizarre enough for me to like them.

...ara? I've encountered plenty of har-- Mass Production Model Evangelion fans. I think they're all batshit insane out of their minds, but...


But now you have more proof.

AMIRITE?


Yeah they were so cool that they didn't see the need to fight Kyoko.


TriLink12 wrote:She said they were "spare Rei's" but seeing as how they'd only lost 2 up to that point in the last 14 years, it hardly seems necessary to keep that many around unless they were using them for dummy systems as well. HmmF, I say they only lost two like that isn't a lot or something.

How did I miss that earlier? Rei has only been around for 10 to 11 years.

RCB wrote:[Rei Ayanami]
The First Children, and dedicated pilot of Eva-00. A young girl who apparently lacks emotions. Her body was created from the salvaged remains of Yui Ikari after Yui was taken into the Eva, and numerous Rei clones were then prepared in Terminal Dogma so that when one Rei dies she can be replaced by another. The present Rei is the third. The first was killed by Dr. Naoko Akagi, and the second died in battle against the 16th Angel. Although the personalities of these three Rei differ from one another, this is due to environmental factors. Their soul is one and the same, and it appears to have been that of Lilith. At the final stage of the Instrumentality Project, Rei betrayed Gendou, returned to Lilith of her own judgment and entrusted the future to Gendou's son -- Shinji Ikari. Birth date: unknown

[Yui Ikari]
Wife of Gendou Ikari, and apparently originally a member of SEELE. She married Gendou (originally Gendou Rokubungi), whom she had been seeing since her Kyoto University years, and gave birth to Shinji. After the marriage she remained active with her husband Gendou at GEHIRN, and worked toward the realization of the E Project. She died in an accident during a test in 2004, but her soul remained inside Eva-01. Further, it seems that this accident was actually intended by her. Age at death: 27


EDIT: Back to the Dummy Plugs, the program books may actually make sense of them. I compiled all the available info on them.

D&R program book wrote:[Dummy Plug]
The limited nature of the pilots is a serious drawback for Evangelion as an all-purpose weapon. The dummy plug is a simulated entry plug developed to operate the Eva without the pilots as a means of overcoming this drawback. The personality of Rei Ayanami is transplanted to the dummy plugs. In addition, soulless Rei Ayanami bodies floating in a giant tank are used as the core of the dummy system.

The dummy system was first used on EVA-01 in the battle against the 13th Angel Bardiel. However, the Eva's behavior at that time did not resemble Rei's piloting in the least, and instead gave the impression of unbridled, feral brutality.


D&R special edition program book wrote:[Dummy Plug]
A mock entry plug developed to achieve unmanned operation of the Eva. The personality of the First Children = Rei Ayanami is transplanted to the dummy plugs. Digitization of the soul is impossible, so the dummy plug is merely a "fake" which simulates thought patterns. However, it is extremely useful for the Evangelion which, due to the limited nature of the pilots, is lacking as an all-purpose weapon. Incidentally, the Eva series units from Eva-05 onward use dummy plugs into which the personality of Kaworu Nagisa has been transplanted.

[Dummy System]
A system designed to simulate the thought patterns of the pilot and thus trick the Eva into thinking that the pilot is synchronizing. The system used in Eva-01 imitated the personality of Rei Ayanami. This system was first released by order of NERV Commander Gendou Ikari in the battle against the 13th Angel. However, the Eva's behavior at that time did not resemble Rei's piloting in the least, and instead appeared to be a berserked state. It seems that only simple commands can be given such as to commence attack, etc.


RCB wrote:[Dummy Plug]
A mock entry plug developed in order to activate and operate the Eva without the pilots. Although the personal pattern of the Children is transplanted to the plug, digitization of the soul is impossible, so the dummy plug merely simulates thought patterns. The dummy plugs prepared by NERV used the personal pattern of the First Children = Rei Ayanami, whereas the dummy plugs prepared by SEELE used the personal pattern of the Fifth Children = Nagisa Kaworu.


NGE2 CI wrote:23. Dummy Plug

A. Publicly Released Information

Data unavailable.

B. Generally Recognized Information

An entry plug developed for use with the Dummy System. Even if no pilot is present, it can activate an Eva by making her think that a pilot is there.

C. Confidential Information

A copy of a personality is made in the Dummy Plug, but a soul cannot be copied. Why can't it be done, or how would it be done? As far as the technology branches of Seele and Nerv are concerned, it is a theme of research integral to seeking out the Path to God, and study into how to deal with the problem has spanned many years. Examples of failure include Yui and Asuka's mother. The Dummy Plug is something that came about in the midst of that research.

D. In-Depth Information

The Dummy System is an artificial soul that was developed at the end of the research. In terms of functionality, however, the Dummy System was severely subpar: Although it could make Eva activate, that was the limit of its capacity.


ep #23 wrote:Misato:
So, this is the source of the dummy plugs?

RITSUKO:
I will show you the truth.

Shinji:
Rei Ayanami?

Misato:
You're not saying the Evas' dummy plugs are...

RITSUKO:
That's right, the part that becomes the core of the dummy system,
and this is the manufacturing plant for it.

Well so much for the plugs having a clone body in them. She's talking about the system she loaded into EVA-01 and EVA-02 as identified by her remote (screenie someone?), not the actual plugs. That wording is very tricky. I'm thinking the Dummy System is similar to the MAGI in that the core of it is a Rei clone brain.

ep #24 wrote:IKARI:
Why did you destroy the dummy system?

RITSUKO:
Not the dummy system, what I destroyed was Rei.

:lol: Dummy System again, not plug. This should teach us to pay closer attention.
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Postby NAveryW » Sat Jan 27, 2007 3:50 pm

I'm sorry, but it looks to me like everything you just quoted points to a Rei body being inside each dummy plug. Where are you getting that it isn't? :?
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Postby Anonymous_Evafan » Sat Jan 27, 2007 3:55 pm

The dummy system and dummy plug are 2 different things.

NGE2 CI wrote:23. Dummy Plug

B. Generally Recognized Information

An entry plug developed for use with the Dummy System. Even if no pilot is present, it can activate an Eva by making her think that a pilot is there.

She is talking about the system not the plug.
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Postby NAveryW » Sat Jan 27, 2007 3:59 pm

I had always assumed they were the same thing. :(

EDIT: Ohh... I think I get it. The Chamber of Guf is actually the dummy system, which communicates via some spiritual bluetooth with the plugs?
Last edited by NAveryW on Sat Jan 27, 2007 4:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Anonymous_Evafan » Sat Jan 27, 2007 4:01 pm

NAveryW wrote:I had always assumed they were the same thing. :(

So did I for quite awhile thanks to ep #18.

EDIT: Ohh... I think I get it. The Chamber of Guf is actually the dummy system, which communicates via some spiritual bluetooth with the plugs?

Say what?
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Postby Rawinder » Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:04 pm

NAveryW wrote:I had always assumed they were the same thing. :(

EDIT: Ohh... I think I get it. The Chamber of Guf is actually the dummy system, which communicates via some spiritual bluetooth with the plugs?


Uh... no.

The dummy system is an AI designed to replace a human pilot. A dummy plug is just an entry plug loaded with the dummy system. In other words, the dummy plug is an unmanned, AI-controlled entry plug.

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Postby felineki » Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:15 pm

I still wanna know WTF was going through the minds of the designers of those things when they decided to swap out the miminalistic humanoid heads of the original Evas for those... whatever the hell the MPs have above their shoulders.

I mean, looking at the show externally, as a piece of art, it's effectively creepy and all. But within the confines of the show, suspending disbelief... WTF? :?

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Postby Anonymous_Evafan » Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:12 pm

Rawinder wrote:
NAveryW wrote:I had always assumed they were the same thing. :(

EDIT: Ohh... I think I get it. The Chamber of Guf is actually the dummy system, which communicates via some spiritual bluetooth with the plugs?


Uh... no.

The dummy system is an AI designed to replace a human pilot. A dummy plug is just an entry plug loaded with the dummy system. In other words, the dummy plug is an unmanned, AI-controlled entry plug.


The dummy system was also loaded into Shinji and Asuka's entry plugs. It certainly didn't look big enough for a Rei clone, but I could see their brains being used to make the artificial soul.
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Postby Reichu » Mon Jan 29, 2007 8:43 am

Anonymous_Evafan wrote:I could see their brains being used to make the artificial soul.

You totally lost me.

Artificial intelligence... data... giant CD-ROM... Makes enough sense to me. The MAGI/brain-correlate that you're looking for is hanging over the dummy plug plant.
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